Sunday, October 28, 2012

What is "Trans?"

Recently Miz Know It All stumbled across a You Tube on Mercedes Allen's site called "The Mask of Gender." In this video, a Registered Psychologist by the name of Jane Oxenbury is speaking as an clear authority on what is this thing called "trans(gender)."

Quote,
Transgendered is actually more scientific term, it's an umbrella term under which, there would be transsexual people, people who feel they are not in the right gender, and people who are trans/and/er/ah transvestites, people who crossdress. So trans--gendered is an umbrella term for those two, but again it's a very scientific term!
(cut)
I mean I have had, I've had a lot of people who've had some really good luck where you know and younger people who have gone to into work places and explained to people that they are in the process of transitioning or that this is who they are now or whatever and they have had some really good luck people are really accepting not all the time though not all the time."

It's clear, even to Miz Know It All that this person is not the least bit comfortable being filmed, so please! Do not fire off hundreds of comments about how this proves that Miz Know It All is just a big Ol' Meannie for included the stammering pauses and the fact that this barely makes any sense.

Cause there is a whole other reason she has done her very very best in putting this down exactly as spoken. That being,  because she has no way to add into the narrative how every-single-time Ms Oxenbury ventured past the term transsexual. Her gaze shifts hard upwards and to the right. Something which in human physiology indicates she is reaching deep into herself to access the creative side of her brain for terms! This despite the fact that she is supposedly describing something which according to her is VERY scientific and, is her stock in trade! Hummmm... I dare say Ms Oxenbury would have no such problem staring us straight in the eye while speaking if she was describing how the earth circled the sun or why the sky was blue, or how babies get made, yet even though this is supposedly her specialty, a thing which she has trained for and which she does day in and day out, she still cannot come close to giving even a remotely clear explanation of what it is she is taking about!

In her very own words, "There are transsexuals and...?"

Ok now to the reason I'm posting this---and it is not as all of you think, to poke fun at Ms Oxenbury or to poke fun anyone for that matter! The one and the ONLY reason I am posting this is because these terms are bandied about like we are all talking about the exact same thing. When the reality, as far as Miz Know It All can see, is that when the words Trans, Transgendered are employed in a conversation. That while they do have whatever meaning speaker thinks them to be. There is no sort of conception, if, on the listeners side they mean even remotely the same things!

So, for now, I am yielding the floor to one and all... Please!This is your turn! So feel completely free to elucidate on the subject to your hearts content! I will delete absolutely no comments unless they veer from the one and the only ground rule here!

No snarkyness about others definitions of the terms trans or transgender!

Really! No matter how far they may be from your definition, please keep it to yourself. Seriously! If we ever are going to have any sort hope ofa dialog then it behooves us to at least hear what others think they are saying when they say...

Trans or Transgender(ed)

MKIA

64 comments:

  1. Ok I'll kick this off. Transgender is a transvestite who cross dresses full-time. There can be no further qualifiers to this because that is indeed where they stop they have no intention of ever having genital surgery. They may however have become so obsessed with transvestism that they undergo cosmetic procedures like breasts or even facial surgery and hair removal. It's this behaviour that causes the layman and I include most medical professionals in this, to confuse them with "transsexuals" whose sole aim in life is to be "complete" i e genital correction whether that is male to female or female to male.

    The abbreviation to "trans" is a habit begun by British civil servants while UK was preparing to pass the "Gender Recognition act 2004" Trans is simply lazy speak for people who did not understand that the legislation they were dealing with was targeted at transsexuals and NOT transgender or transvestites. I see them as having sneaked in under the radar using the confusion and ignorance of probably well meaning burocrats.

    Cassandraspeaks

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  2. That term, "trans", was the vehicle used by those full and part time cross-dressers to conflate those two distinct conditions, trans-sexual and trans-vestite.

    And while we have been offered the opportunity by Mis-know-it-All to address those misunderstood, mis-used and mistakenly disparaged terms, I wouldlie to point out that 'transvestite' is not a pejorative. It is nothing more that a word derived from the Latin word 'vestire', which means simply to dress.

    So the word transvestite describes nothing more than someone who cross-dresses. Trans-gender, one who crosses gender roles. Trans-sexual is then someone who crosses or 'changes' sex.

    Sandy

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  3. Transgender or trans

    A group of people in the population who experience, sometimes catastrophically, that their gender identity (i.e. male or female) is not a full expression of who they are as persons, their gender experience is fluid. These persons are gender variant because their gender experience is moveable. Gender variance encompasses many forms of gender identity expressions.

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  4. I understand getting mad at people not using words the way they should be - my personal pet peeve is the word, "publicist." I hate when people think, especially PR people themselves, that a publicist is a PR Person.

    Of course it's not. A "publicist" is a journalist primarily concerned with current affairs. George F. Will is a publicist. Madonna's PR Hack is not.

    But over-time a word can be misused so frequently, that its accepted definition is actually changed by society. That's part of what they mean when they say English is a "living" language.

    And at that point you just have to accept failure, give up and move on with your life.

    You've reached that point, Miz.

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  5. Please don't anyone be insulted by this. I sent this to MKIA twice, but no response. I sent it to wake "her" up. I went through my changes during a time that realizing my transgender connections was not an insult. Actually, I met some very wonderful people, "Truly Transexual" or not. I moved on well beyond the need to hurt other people simply because they thought differently than me. I was one of Lynn Conway's first TS Successes that she listed before her photo pages. I removed myself from there because I don't believe in exploiting issues beyond the limits of my own values. Yes, I understand what "MKIA and friends" need to get out of their systems, but I also understand that we are all individuals, and if we can't live with other people's beliefs, then we should learn to let it go, rather than to destroy all respect for some of the basic aspects of humanity.
    .......................... to follow

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  6. Dear MKIA,

    I wondered where you were going with your blog. You seemed to have given up way back when you claimed to be train-wrecked. For awhile, I became the center of the mockery. You didn't spare too much of your hatred either. Ignorance won out for several of you, and you all showed very clearly how honest discussion could evolve into hatred....all guided by the same impetus.

    I am 12 years post-op. It was long overdue. I once had a website where I actually did help many people. There were people like me, and you, and there were also those who were very lost within their own confusion, or should I use the term "dilemma", not knowing which way to go, driven by passion rather than common sense. I met some very beautiful people, but I was always honest with them, about the image "they presented", making it fairly clear if I felt that they were not really cut out for it. I always tried to use compassion rather then insult.

    Later on I personally met some very well-known people, those who others relied upon and looked up to for guidance. But it wasn't what I thought. I knew that I was one of the very few to survive being born with the wrong body, and living too many years through the daily trauma of having to play a part, lying to myself.

    When I transitioned I felt that I was pretty sure of the game, but I see that over the years it has changed. It is not so much the transition to become who we are inside, but now a large playing field for those who are looking for the "taste" of being something different. Whatever feels good, and then-some.

    Please do not take it the wrong way, but I don't know why people like Liz, you, and some others take so much interest in other people's lifestyles. The only reason I ever entered any of those forums is out of curiosity, and just trying to bring back some civility. So I get slammed as a fake. That is as far as it went.

    Please try to be more open-minded with the people who are different from you. Instead of mocking them, please just walk away from it if it gives you so much angst. Life outside of the "trans thing" will still go on, and if I were to make a choice for my own well-being, I would have chosen to never have had to go through all of the pain I had to endure....including the loss of faith.

    I lost faith in many of those people who were supposedly there for me, because of the letdown of being lied to, or to discover that those who I trusted would turn in whatever direction it took them, even at the cost of their credibility just so they maintained their popularity, or filled their pockets. I could not believe how people like Lynn Conway, and friends could trade-in their "womanhood", and and be so willing to cash it all in for the "Transgender" cause....which of course, you and I know, is far remote from a born transsexual just trying to live a normal life.

    It took awhile for me to move on, maybe because I was just as concerned about that dark cloud of transgender confusion as you might now be, but I've learned to let it go, in as, as my reality goes, it is not my life.



    I wrote this to you hoping that it could turn on a light for you. Take care,


    June H.

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  7. June, Jamie,
    You both begged the question of how do you define "trans" by telling me to pack my bags and hit the trail, "for my own good" of course!

    Sorry but I scarcely see how my asking the question is belittling of others or such a colossal fail on my part that I should fade into the sunset for the asking! After all, anyone with my history, as well as a plethora of others of all sort of histories are told repeatedly that these two words define them, but no one will offer anything other than the vaguest of hand waves and a "oh you know what I mean" as to what exactly the definition of "trans" is?

    That is all I am asking here... what meaning do YOU give to the words "trans and or transgender?"
    MKIA

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  8. @June Hingle

    You vile worthless piece of human excrement! I guess you have crawled out from under your rock where all the other snakes gather or maybe you are overdosing on your psychotropic medications again.

    Poor June the mistreated lunatic that has been forcibly evicted or banned from every place she has posted except here.

    I have suspicions why someone I know online stopped posting and my bet is you threatened to out them unless they followed your lead or let you comment freely. We all know who that was.

    Every comment you make turns into a June Hingle tribute produced by yourself. That is akin to allowing a rabid animal free on society. It is always about June and how poor June is a voice of reason in a world gone mad. Sorry but you are June the loon and everyone knows it.

    Remember June I know all about your roof disappearing off the garage and you suddenly realizing you had a gender issue and thus must be transsexual and how at 50 something you found some quack therapist that you claim described you as Type VI. Your bullshit should require hip boots for all readers.

    MKIA should be very wary of anything sent by you. Well it is almost Halloween so maybe you will crawl back into your hole with any other spawns of the devil.

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  9. Another TG attempt at a derail is it. Pwrhaps because it is well known there is no definition of "transgender" or "trans" other than the one I gave in the first comment. We were asked not to get snarky with other commenters so I will refrain. That said Jamie and June are well suited to each other.

    Cassandraspeaks

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  10. Again, as I have pointed out many times, "transgender" is an artificial social/political construct that has no objective basis, and which is a very subjective term. To call it remotely "scientific" is ridiculous. It grew out of an attempt to co-opt transsexuals in order to further the interests of crossdressing men. It should never be applied to anyone who has not indicated that they identify as transgender. And it certainly should not be forced on those who object to it.

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  11. "Who is anyone really fooling when it is said over and over again what is between your legs doesn't matter? Isn't the most obvious question to ask someone who had sex reassignment surgery why they went to such great trouble to change what was between their legs? If it isn't important how could anyone advocate for its coverage by medical insurance as non cosmetic surgery. Are people who dismiss the significance of SRS allies of people who are transsexual? Aren't such people working against the interests of people who are transsexual?

    Many of the people you say we should be allied with are the same ones pointing the finger at others insisting such things as, "you only did this because you had a body mapping issue." . . . " You have a penis that was sliced open and shoved up inside of you to SIMULATE a vagina." . . . You're vagina isn't self lubricating" . . . Do you consider people like these to be allies of people who have a need to reject a sex assignment and be physically and legally reassigned their sex? There is enormous hostility among trans people for transsexual people who go through SRS. Such people work against the interests of people who are transsexual. Such people are ignorant of just how many kinds of vaginoplasties there are and the wide variety of woman who have them and how outcomes vary.

    People are assigned a sex based on objective identification based on external genitalia. People who are transsexual have feelings of incongruence that is as physiological as it is anatomical. You can't separate anatomy from physiology.

    Either you agree that people who are transsexual can change sex and respect those who do unequivocally as the males or females that they transition to, which it is possible to do while respecting those who would wish to remain one of the many varieties of "trans"that do not include post transsexual people or your stance toward them is hostile when one considers the proactive needs of those born transsexual who are very different than those who do not have those same needs."

    Posted by Edithrua as a comment here:

    http://www.transadvocate.com/a-transsexual-versus-transgender-intervention.htm

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  12. Posted by another woman who is fed up with the TeeGee Mafia tactics of intimidation, demonization, and name calling...

    "Now, isn’t this special. Straight transsexuals “…should stop trying to convince the world that all transsexuals are straight and want out of the LGBT umbrella.”

    "Are you so out of touch that you don’t realize that there is no debate. Are you so clueless that you don’t have an inkling that straight transsexual have no say so whatsoever within the GLBT?

    Do you not realize that we are repeatedly banned from blogs for simply not following or repeating the GLBT/transgender mantra? Or, for questioning the wisdom of calling a simple castration a sex change surgery? Or for trying to garner recognition of our heterosexual issues within an organization that is overwhelmingly homosexual in every way…G-L-B and T? Do you really not recognize that there is no debate?"

    "...there is no consideration given to those of us who are straight...what “greatly concerns” you is not the plight of heterosexual transsexuals
    but those of “queer-identified trans women.”

    There is no debate. What there is is a few of us who are pretty
    much fed up with being silenced, banned, and shouted down from any discourse that is not homo centric. We are fed up with being told that we should “…stop trying to convince the world…”, not that all transsexuals are straight, but that any transsexuals are.

    This is really the bottom line I think. Straight transsexuals should just STFU. They should just happily settle into being captured by a gay organization that does their best, like you, to silence them, doesn’t speak for them, holds them captive, and, hell, doesn’t even acknowledge they exist…except to say they can’t leave because if they left that would “…severely undermine the modest gains that queer-identified trans women have made…”

    http://www.transadvocate.com/a-transsexual-versus-transgender-intervention.htm

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  13. It is not possible to change your sex. You can change you hormones and modify your body cosmetically and surgically, but you can never change your sex. Dr Biber thought that as did Harry Benjamin.

    What you can change is your "gender role".

    Here's the way Anne Vitale puts it:

    SEX CHANGE
    Lastly-- the term “Sex Change” is also misleading. Technically sex is defined by chromosomal composition at the time of conception. Obviously, no amount of hormonal manipulation or surgery will ever change that. When you combine this with the fact that there is a spectrum of chromosomal variations possible at conception resulting in various intersex conditions, using a binary sex descriptors as positive markers is in reality only relativistic.

    "Although the term “sex change” is rarely if ever used in professional circles, it is common in the lay press. This indicates to me that there is a large gulf between what specialists in the field of gender issues understand about sexual assignment/reassignment and that of the lay world. I suggest that the term “gender role transition” be used instead. I first heard the term “gender role transition” used three years ago by Rebecca Auge Ph.D. during a peer supervision group. After discussing it in great detail with her, I have since adopted it and encourage others to do so as well."



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  14. @last Anonymous

    That is complete and total BULLSHIT. Gender is a social construct. Sex is defined by genitalia and by correcting the birth mistake one certainly does change sexual characteristics which for all normal purposes is a sex change.

    Anne Vitale is an idiot with a PhD. There are many of them in the world as is Rebecca Auge. It is all part of we are all the same bullshit aimed at pleasing men.

    I changed my sex role not my gender role. I was always a little girl and needed to match my genitalia to be complete. Benjamin believed in this and the entire concept of gender role transition is complete and utter BULLSHIT. Which gender are you transitioning to? There are so many since gender is fluid but then that is what you and assholes like yourself want.

    If it is gender then pathetic little men get to play girl whenever they want. You lose automatically by using Anne Vitale and Rebecca auge. That is equivalent to calling someone a Nazi because they disagree with you.

    Harry Benjamin absolutely believed one could change sex. One can never be completely female but some genetic females have the same or similar issues we have and chromosomes can be all over the place.

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  15. Personally I define transgender as using gender expression in a non normative way, frequently opposite to that assigned at birth. See it as a worthwhile political coalition for certain limited aims and nothing more.
    Transsexual I'd say was living, or aspiring to live, in the gender opposite your assigned birth gender on a permanent 24/7 basis, usually with hormonal change and sometimes with different surgeries. A large element of these will share female neurological development.
    Again personally, I tend to use trans as something inbetween. I don't refer to cross dressers as trans but would so refer to anyone gender variant in a way that meant living in their normal gender was viewed as transgessive.
    Feel attempts at differentiating in terms of 'gender' and 'sex' changes fundamentally misplaced. A transsexual may attain their chosen congruence by alterations to mind, behaviour and body forms, individuals varying as to how that mix works for them. A person who has only one of these elements might probably not be a 'real transsexual' though medical exceptions exist,but two or more would be sufficient as far as I'm concerned. Otherwise one could use neurological/cognitive measurement techniques if one were, say, to seek to limit treatment to people who are 'really' of the opposite gender rather than fetishists or closeted gays or etc etc.
    Apart from that neurological element, don't see any validity in using measures, especially toxic performative ones, and, @Kathryn, don't see the onset of a condition as particularly relevant to treatment or taxonomy.
    Would see none of the above as an enforced co-opting term as far as any specific individual is concerned.

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  16. The question was how do I define trans* or transgender. Easy as "Sop-hi says,it means gender trangression.

    But of course answering the question is just not enough for Sop-Hi. He insists on defining that which he knows nothing about and then lecturing the rst of us on the how's, why's and wherefor's.

    How trans* of him.

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  17. Sophie:

    ...don't see the onset of a condition as particularly relevant to treatment or taxonomy.

    I am not sure what you mean by "onset". The nature of a condition is the basis for it's treatment.

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  18. @Kathryn. The nature of the condition being talked of in transsexuality is that of a person with a stable neurological configuration opposite to assigned/anatomical sex. Whether they spring from their mothers womb asserting that or only reach that stage through neural disambiguation, doesn't seem a major variable re the nature of the treatment required.
    @Anonymous. So as to save you the effort of actually reading the original post, here's what MKIA wrote, and will presumably act on at some point by deleting your offensive comment.
    So, for now, I am yielding the floor to one and all... Please!This is your turn! So feel completely free to elucidate on the subject to your hearts content! I will delete absolutely no comments unless they veer from the one and the only ground rule here!

    No snarkyness about others definitions of the terms trans or transgender!

    Really! No matter how far they may be from your definition, please keep it to yourself. Seriously! If we ever are going to have any sort hope ofa dialog then it behooves us to at least hear what others think they are saying when they say.

    ReplyDelete
  19. OK Soppy, I will spell it out for you. Trans/transgender has nothing to do with transsexualism. Apples and oranges.

    What I see so exceedingly male about some transies is their stupid stubborn insistance that they are that which they are not.

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  20. Still here? Presume MKIA is otherwise engaged.
    Since you still seem incapable of reading and/or engaging brain before writing, let me spell it out for you. Yes, the two are highly different things in my opinion. Yes they are apples and oranges. One is an umbrella term principally defining groups whose members may feel a common political identity regarding certain basic civil rights aims. The which hopefully add some impetus to those additional legal difficulties faced by transsexuals.
    Transsexuality is, by contrast, a term describing one specific group of binary transitioners usually, but not always, accompanied by their neurological structures being similar to their target sex.
    My personal take on 'trans' is to use it of a group, including transsexuals, who are 'transgressive' as regards gender presentation not simply in performance but because their condition has some kind of neurological component. Others may use it differently.
    Note that I'm not trying to define anything by 'transgressive', just using it to point out commonalities. If, say, MKIA doesn't feel in the least bit transgressive, at least as regards her historical narrative, then it is difficult to come up with the slightest reason for, say, stealth.
    Now, just a small suggestion for you, dear anon. Maybe you could actually give your personal take on what those terms mean to you in some sort of positive sense so that you're entering into the spirit of dialogue as MKIA states that she wants. Just man up and give it your best shot.

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  21. I'm actually still waiting to see my civil rights trampled, Sophie. Just which ones did I lose, those many years ago?

    As for "trans," it's a meaningless term, at this point. It means whatever the speaker wants it to mean now; no matter what the purported "original" meaning was. Goodness, now it even means "transgressive" and a "common political identity!"

    Since I avoid politics, and don't feel the least bit transgressive, may I be excluded, please?

    - Jennifer

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  22. That is the whole point. It means whatever the speaker says it does. Just like transies. To me it means chicks with dicks, or men in dresses.

    To others it means a pervy ticket to the ladies shower.

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  23. @Jennifer. One would have thought that some protection against being fired when you start transition, or a hate crimes statute targeting gender expression would both be things that affect trans, transgender and transsexual alike. And that they generally come under the heading of 'civil rights legislation'.
    Agreed there isn't a common meaning for 'trans' but that doesn't stop attempts to come up with a useful definition for it.
    Regarding politics re civil rights or rights to appropriate medical treatment, if you don't want to join in then naturally you're excused. But if you're not worried about being seen as transgressive, why did you make an outcry about being 'outed' to your church groups a few months ago ? Surely not that you might have problems by being seen as too conventional.

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  24. Outed to church groups? Hard to do when I told them myself, since I was hoping to remain a part of them, and they supported me through it. Do you have the right Jennifer?

    Now me, I've never been for any hate crime legislation. If I'm beaten up, maimed, killed, or whatever, there's the crime right there. Why is the crime any worse because of why they did it? I've already been beaten up, maimed, or killed. Prove what is in the perpetrator's mind when it happens. What if it's not because of my gender expression, and they were hoping I had a lot of money on me? Is that less of a crime then? At least it wasn't because I was "dressed funny," I suppose. Thank goodness, right?

    And job protection? Please. If they want you gone, they make you gone, very legally. generally speaking, it helps to make yourself an asset to your employer, and have them see that you are someone to be valued, rather than tell them they have no right to fire you. That often seems to backfire, strangely enough.

    I'll have ask my doctor if I'm receiving second class treatment next week at my appointment. I hadn't noticed, and hadn't brought up my status when I started seeing her about five years ago, but it's in my history, so I'm pretty sure that she knows.

    Lucky? Perhaps. Or maybe my attitude and outlook make a difference. You'd be surprised how far working with people goes, I think.

    - Jennifer

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  25. Apologies, the wrong Jennifer indeed.
    I haven't been assaulted so far, but know many ordinary looking transsexuals who have been. I don't think hate crimes legislation would prevent such in the short term, but it does seem in many societies that such legislation does contribute to a fall in such crimes. Difficult, sometimes, but by no means impossible to enforce.
    Employment legislation would seem desirable given the number who are thrown out of work, regardless of their history, after they start transition, as a general civil rights issue. A good attitude may help but it's hardly universally effective.
    But if you're not interested, no-ones forcing you. You're only being coopted in the same way as the NAACP coopts afro-americans.

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  26. "I haven't been assaulted so far, but know many ordinary looking transsexuals who have been"~Sophie

    Ordinary looking "transsexuals"? There's a high controversial statement for a multitude of reasons.

    What does someone who changes their primary and secondary sex charcteristics ordinarily look like in your opinion Sophie? you?

    If someone can do as Miz has suggested here and truly define "trans" the I suspect those are the people you're reffering to and I suspect it has little or NOTHING to do with their appearance and a great deal to do with how they choose to comduct themselves.

    And of the VERY few people I have ever met (relative to the many I've met who dub themselves "trans") who've actually experienced psycho-sexual inversion; NOT ONE (who has transitioned successfully and been accepted/blends in as their correct sex), has chosen to conduct themselves in that manner.

    "But if you're not interested, no-ones forcing you. You're only being coopted in the same way as the NAACP coopts afro-americans."~Sophie

    Male arrogance in it's purest form, I don't care if MKIA deletes this comment, I'm hopeful it will reach you via email subscription anyway.

    You and your kind are all total pieces of shit Sophie.

    Signed

    Me.

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  27. Where will it end?

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/11/washington-college-oks-exposure-of-young-girls-to-transgender-male-in-locker-room/

    http://patriotupdate.com/articles/time-to-normalize-pedophilia-firsthand-report-on-b4u-act-conference

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  28. Wow, I guess it's true what they say, "When the cat's away, the mice will play!" And play you have! Having a very real life far far away from Blog-O-Stan, I've not had the time to come and peek in on my dear dear campers, figuring... "they're adults... they can take care of themselves..." Apparently I was quite wrong and I scarcely know where to start! Do I delete the whole mess... or do I just toss my hands in the air and let this go and see where it winds up... Me thinks the latter! So go ahead have at it y'all, the kitchen is a wreck now so you might as well make a day of it and do the rest of the house as well!
    MKIA

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  29. I think the original question was: what do they mean when they say trans or transgender(ed)?

    It is interesting that few have tried to answer that question. I would have liked to know.

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  30. @'Me'. To clarify, I was talking about transsexual men and women who seemed ordinary looking judging by the normal social standards of their expressed gender.
    Socially, apart from my grand total of 2 support group meetings, I semi regularly see one cd, several genderqueer folk and a few post op men and women, in all about 2% of the people I hang out with. I meet a lot more long term post op people by virtue of the fact that many of them are semi-stealth and sometimes appreciate talking to another person about trans perspectives.They come here because of the fact that they presume some kind of intelligence in me to do my job and that I'm openly trans.
    If you're thinking of conduct in terms of going to pride marches, the club scene or anything like that, you're profoundly mistaken.
    Like many 'anons' on this blog you make a great deal of assumptions and make a habit of judging, insulting and using gutter vocabulary, and then throw out some nonsensical diagnosis of male hubris. Sorry, it just doesn't get more male than that.


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  31. I can see I haven't missed much, the usual homosexual tranny suspects have chimed in with their filth toward those of us who have aligned our bodies with our STRAIGHT minds. As far as I am concerned the LGBT can burn in hell, they have done nothing for me and have done more damage to the reputation of legitimate transsexuals homosexual or otherwise.

    So MKIA
    You ask what is trans?
    Trans is a virus a disease that has perverted transsexuality into something it is not. Trans is a tissue that closeted crossdressers hide behind in order to hide their homosexuality from family members and themselves.
    Trans is a weapon used to intern the unwilling in the hell of the GLBT. Trans is hate in a dress disguising a penis packing misogynist who's purpose in life is to invade colonize and degrade women's spaces.
    That is what trans is, and it has no place in polite society.

    NYF

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  32. Heya Sop. You would not recognize a transsexual if they bit you on your skinny ass. Noo honest to goodness man or woman would be caught dead within 100km. of you or your support group.

    Trannys, TeeGee's and Gender Queers have nothing to do with transsexuals so stop trying to legitimize your weirdness with those that are or may have been transsexual.

    If you could read, you would know the question was about trans, trannys and tg's, NOT transsexuals.

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  33. @Sophie

    Something you fail to understand or perhaps lack the intellect to grasp is the ease with which I see through your rhetric and lame excuses for your lifestyle. Far from using the "gutter vocabulary" I simply follow a lesson taught me by my college professor and that was to use language and terms that are easily understood by anyone who cares to either read or hear what I say. I learned that if you cannot explain something in simple terms you do not understand your subject well enough. Well Sophie, I doubt and seriously doubt you understand this subject at all by the sheer wayward nature of everything you write. You may superficially fool the ill informed with whom you socialise. You do not however fool me. Now before you claim I do not know you, I have read your blog and I understand completely and fully just where your urges and lifestyle choices emanate.

    Now for the record, I don't care, your life is simply your life and what you choose to do with it and how you conduct yourself within it and amongst your associates is of no consequence to me. Just stay out of female spaces and leave the kids alone. By that I mean do not indoctrinate young transsexuals with your misinformation and hubris. Is that clear enough for you?

    I don't hate you I do however pity you and are truly beneath my contempt for your crude attempt to justify the unjustifiable. I am not one of the anons you refer to in such a disparaging manner, I always sign my comments and actually write a blog. I just choose to keep my private life just that private. It's none of your business and my medical history none of anyone else's either as is my right.

    Cassandraspeaks

    ReplyDelete
  34. The following two statements were made to me recently:

    “Sorry but a TG is just a GUY that crossdresses and decides to cut his male parts off and make a "FAKE" vagina and take female hormones. At the end of the day you are still a guy. It's the whole thing of putting lipstick on a pig and it's still a pig. “ by a crossdresser directed at me

    “ We have every compassion for transgender persons but if a 21 year old women for significant medical reasons requested a hysterectomy, everything would be done to prevent her from doing so. Women of that age should not be rendered infertile unless catastrophic illness requires it.” A government official made to me about a FtM transsexual.

    Interesting isn't it. I understand the anger expressed by transsexuals that feel co-opted by "we're all the same" representation. In fact it impacts much deeper than just speculation but is reality with which I both personally and professionally deal with on an ongoing basis.

    This political statement harms all transsexuals, because it is directly connected to a complete public misapprehension of my historical condition which I have overcome. It is a direct result of the conflation of sex and gender into one defining elements of human existence. My job both personally and professionally is to draw a distinction that permits appropriate health care to become available.

    Being angered has not helped me defining that distinction.

    In addition I, like many, have no common political objectives with the gender variant and "transgender" community; simply none.

    Discrimination, harassment etc for transsexuals is a function of their medical history rather than an inevitable fact of life. When you’re healed, well you're healed and your history no longer is relevant for the public discourse. Did some of us experience discrimination, yes we did, but most importantly we do by being co-opted into something that has no connection with who we are.

    The analogy with the NAACP is of course completely off the mark and in complete disregard of the nature of race and transsexuality, an empty argument. In fact this remark is just as off the cuff as either of the statements referred to above designed to deny the crucial differentiation between gender variance and transsexualism. It is easy to make such remarks. It is much harder to really develop an understanding of reality and speak about that comprehensively. It might involve some real work.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Oh well, back on the insult nonsense so a quick farewell.
    @anon. Can't match your obvious chasers eye for a transsexual.
    @Cassandra speaks.Good that you remember you're not one of the anons, and that you can read. Practice and understanding may follow.
    @Sue-anne. Couldn't agree more. All these trannies coming out with penis obsessed fantasies of swedish assistants and...er....such a contrast to autogynophiles like yourself.
    Toodle pip dears.

    ReplyDelete
  36. Well this discussion has been delightful.
    @ Sophie...Can't take reality?
    @ Miz... see what you have stirred up again?
    @ NYF....you knew this was where the discussion was headed.
    @ the rest .... trans is a nonsense term coined by freaks as a politically acceptable term for "I don't know what I am but I'm neither man nor woman".

    ReplyDelete
  37. Did SopHead just try to insult everybody by placing himself above everybody else. What a pathetic effort.

    This poor sap must be on some weird drugs. Can't even make any sense, much less construct sentence. Poor thing. Sorry to cya go.

    roflmao

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  38. sounds like a pretty intuitive crossdresser Kathryn.

    ReplyDelete
  39. To the anon comment two comments above this one.
    Sophie is just asserting male privilege and telling us all who and what we are.

    You know what they say,
    You can always tell a tranny, you just can't tell them much.


    NYF

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  40. @Kathryn Dumke, you are starting to actually "get it" and to understand just where those like me have been arguing from and campaigning about around the blogs. You just presented a good argument and I thank you.

    Cassandraspeaks

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  41. Curious,

    There were actually a few very different and quite notable attempts made to answer the question, between the vitriol and anger (much of which I too feel) as to "what is trans?"

    Like Kathryn, Given that it seems "the community" is a thousands strong version of the blind men and the elephant, I too would have liked to have gotten more of "their" answers to this. Cause while I know darn good and well what I think it to be when I hear "trans" said, it is very clear that this is NOT what is being intended by these many speakers, particularly among the FtM crowd!

    So if there are any still lurking round the edges to this, feel free to add your two cents worth!
    MKIA

    ReplyDelete
  42. "Trans" is an addiction.

    From Wikipedia:

    "Classic hallmarks of addiction include: impaired control over substances/behavior, preoccupation with substance/behavior, continued use despite consequences, and denial.[3] Habits and patterns associated with addiction are typically characterized by immediate gratification (short-term reward), coupled with delayed deleterious effects (long-term costs)."

    Sound familiar?

    ReplyDelete
  43. http://evangelinacarters.wordpress.com/2012/09/24/transvestism-is-a-narcotic-drug/

    Cassandraspeaks

    ReplyDelete

  44. Elizabeth wrote:

    "I have suspicions why someone I know online stopped posting and my bet is you threatened to out them unless they followed your lead or let you comment freely. We all know who that was."

    ...........................

    As I seem to recollect, you are the ONLY person who has posted personal information on YOUR FRIEND:

    http://ben-girl-notesfromthetside.blogspot.com/2012/01/high-intensity-transsexualism.html

    Several people, including myself, already knew her real name because she posted photos that linked her to another site, and another, and another...

    You are the ONLY person who PUBLICLY posted that info, and actually made it easier for anyone to find her. Of course, it was a brilliant move by YOU because as everyone knows, you are shameless, and as clean as a freshly skinned pig's behind.

    JH

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  45. To MKIA,

    If you really want an answer to your question, then perhaps you should talk directly to the people who, through the years, have changed the wordings of the original HBIGDA Standards of Care. People such as Dr. Anne Lawrence (an admitted autogynephile) was on that committee. People like Willow Arune, one of Anne's most devout followers did her best to spread Ray Blanchard's theories.

    Perhaps you should speak directly to Lynn Conway, Calpernia Addams, or Andrea James. Ask them why they ID as "Transgender". They are the people who were the most combative during the time when definitions began to become so blurred.

    Here is the link that will connect you to them all:

    http://ai.eecs.umich.edu/people/conway/conway.html


    JH

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  46. "Perhaps you should speak directly to Lynn Conway, Calpernia Addams, or Andrea James. Ask them why they ID as "Transgender". They are the people who were the most combative during the time when definitions began to become so blurred. "

    No truer words were ever spoken.
    The disguised gay men who hijacked the transsexual narrative.

    ReplyDelete
  47. First off, sex is a verb word, it is an action word, as in having sex, that is the same as making love.. I have yet to hear of anyone having gender as a verb word, an action word.

    Maybe my english teacher was wrong in teaching me about action words, but I am my gender I do not do my gender like I would do sex, if I actually did do sex, or make love...

    2ndly, transgender is an outdated term, that once included the transsexual community. As time elapses, we fall outside of this so called umbrella term for 1 reason, the non transsexual community does not have to suffer the imposed real life test, that the morons in psych think we need to do in order to have gender reassignment or a better term gender confirmation surgery.

    3rdly, are we trans for life, or is it a phase of life, such as childhood is a phase, we get to 13 and we refer to ourselves as teenagers, and so one, we were teenagers, we outgrow that label, so we outgrow the trans label as we flourish into our new genders...

    Rant over, you can resume normal programming...

    ReplyDelete
  48. Your English teacher forgot to tell you Sex is an adverb see the examples below.

    "The sex of the dog is female."
    The sex of the man in the dress is male because he has a penis"

    As for being trans for life that is more of the same Tee-Gee bullshit.
    That is like saying someone who was deaf at birth and had her hearing restored is deaf for life.

    ReplyDelete
  49. I feel it does not become us well at all if we allow unbridled homophobia to be left unchallenged as it did with the line

    "No truer words were ever spoken.
    The disguised gay men who hijacked the transsexual narrative."

    It is NOT gay men and women who are our issue, it is the hetro-normative men in dresses who have taken on the sheeps clothing of "Same Sex/LGBT" as Lesbians to be a foil to their own innate homophobia! Lest they possibly be seen as shudder something queer for actually acting like a woman. You know letting a man touch them in "that way!"

    ReplyDelete
  50. I beg to differ,
    In this case that is who those creeps are.

    We shall agree to disagree.

    ReplyDelete
  51. Thank you Anon @ 5:24 PM for your backup.


    JH

    ps. please try to curb the h'fobia stuff. Adding more labels doesn't resolve the issue. I hope that MKIA will take the advice as written. It would resolve a lot of the misnomers. huggz

    ReplyDelete
  52. pointing out a fact isn't homophobia.
    Just because I am the only one with the guts to call a spade a spade, doesn't make me a homophobe.

    But like I said, we can agree to disagree.

    ReplyDelete
  53. I understand. Please view this link:

    http://web.archive.org/web/20010710202808/http://ai.eecs.umich.edu/people/conway/TSsuccesses/TSsuccesses.html

    That was 2001. I am pictured next to Andrea James. At the top is "Carla Antonelli". Shortly after that Lynn emailed me, and asked me to call her at home. It was about "Carla". Lynn was mislead into believing that Carla was post-op. Lynn was so angry at Carla, and the words she said about her were very H'fobic. I speak spanish, and knew Carla well. I did not put Carla down because of her transition status, but I was up-front with her about how she was lying to people. Lynn wanted to completely remove Carla from her site, but I told her that I felt that Carla has helped many people regardless of her "sex designation".

    I believe that Lynn chose to "unify" people who ID'd as "Transgender". Whether one believes that Lynn is one thing or another, it does not change the agenda. Whether we see it as good or bad, it was Lynn's choice, and she continues to enlighten people about "Trans" issues. Her reasons for exposing her life, as do the others, is their business, and would appear helpful to many as far as the discovery of their own "truths".

    What appears to me is; that much of the "Trans" thing has been exploited far beyond the ability to explain it. It goes way beyond definitions, and becomes so personal that each individual holds the "key" to their own definition of themselves. So the term "Trans" is basically a nickname for a word that means "change". It is part of life, and for a person who ID's as "Transgender" it would appear to be something still in transition, and evolving. Of course, that is how I imagine what I see of it.


    take care,

    JH

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  54. Jeez-oh-petes, June Hingle. Will you ever get over that deal with Lynn Conway? Nobody gives a rat's ass except for you, and like a scratched record, you keep playing that over and over and over, ad nauseum.

    Next your garage roof will be going for another flight or something.

    Look, we get it. You're off your meds again. Maybe it's time to look for a good home, perhaps something in assisted living...... without an internet connection.

    ReplyDelete
  55. June Hingle

    You arrogant stinking piece of dog shit! You have the unmitigated gall to try and out someone on my blog? Fuck you to straight to hell! Twice! You've just proved every horrible thing I've ever heard said about you to be true!

    I hope you get cancer and die!
    MKIA

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  56. @All

    That name is not me and never has been me. It is June's delusion since it is the name I made up to get a live.com email account. June is batshit crazy even if since she has had SRS she is a woman. She is a spawn of the devil and has been banned or removed from every blog or website she has ever belonged to.

    I have never outed anyone and would not. I prevented BlackSwan from accidentally outing herself when she posted a comment on my blog with her real name and signed it BlackSwan. Drunk and stupid is a bad combination.

    June is decidedly off the wall. One minute she wants to be your friend and the next she is accusing a 16 year old child transsexual like I was, with a boyfriend, of running around with all my gay boyfriends doing who knows what.

    I appreciate the gesture but June is not known as June the Loon the lost character from Looney Tunes for nothing. She hates anyone that has actually had a life such as Lynn Conway.

    You should moderate comments and deny Hingle access.

    ReplyDelete
  57. There are reasons to not like Lynn Conway Conway has been guzzling Tee-Gee Kool-Aid for over two decades now. June on the other hand has been, as you put it batshit crazy ever sense the usenet days, one of the last places June can still post without moderation.

    It's regrettable we have to put up with the nutcases, egomaniacs and the lifestyle fetishists speaking on behalf of us, we must not only distance ourselves from them but we must display their creepy and nutty behavior for all to see, letting the world know we are not them.

    NYF

    ReplyDelete
  58. This is trans and how it interacts with the real world.
    http://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2012/11/07/a-gendertrender-chat-with-autumn-sandeen/

    And these trans activists want to help us.

    fuck that.


    NYF

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  59. Autumn certainly displayed himself as all woman in that interaction didn't he?

    ReplyDelete
  60. I think we all agree that Autumn Sandeen is only partly described as an Ass****e. The rest of any description or contempt I have for the man was laid out quite clearly by Gallus Mag in the exchange she had with him. She and the ladies at Gendertrender pretty much have him pegged. When it comes down to having an enemy in the transgender activists we should be natural allies. However, I have little doubt that the ladies of Gendertrender see no difference between like likes of Autumn Sandeen and the rest of the Colleen Francis's of this world. In fact in that exchange he has with GM he states quite clearly that he intends to do a number at Michegan Womens Festival. I wouldn't put it past the FW to wave his worthless piece of paper and his Dick at them as he marches military style towards the gates. I do hope they have a warm reception waiting for him.

    I alo note that Miz you were invited to write a guest post on the issue of Autumn Sandeen and his Ilk. I think it would be ill advised to take up the invitation. I wishh it were different but philosophically they seem unwilling to understand that there are a few genuine cases of transexual they may actually find acceptable if they took the trouble to get to know us.

    It is likely a set up Miz, they'll try to rip you to shreds whatever you say though it hurts to say that because we should be allies.

    Cassandraspeaks

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  61. Wow, I just read that. All activist, all trans-whatever-that means anyway, no women in sight as is quite befitting.

    ReplyDelete
  62. @Elizabeth, I appreciate it.

    BlackSwan

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  63. Cassandra
    I think you have it right as far as MKIA doing a guest peace over at GT.
    While they have as much contempt for MR. Sandeen as we do, they are not our friends. . The enemy of my enemy is my friend is a false assumption, and should be never relied upon for anything but a good backstabbing. They hold as much contempt for us as they for the Tee-Gees, and in their own way they are as bad as any group who is ignorant by choice when it comes to a particular group of people. Neogynophobia is a sickness just like racism. The good news is they are taken as seriously as the Tee-Gees by the greater LGBT.

    It's very telling how Sandeen swears at women like he does, brings out the man in him. A friend who lives near Sandeen says Sandeen swears like that all the time in real life and is not very fast on his feet verbally speaking. He doesn't have a large vocabulary at his fingertips, it must be the psych meds, perhaps he needs to have his medication readjusted.

    Not Your Friend.

    ReplyDelete
  64. THE EVOLUTION OF TRANSGENDER

    1990: That word before "Tapestry"
    1995: A pre-operative transsexual
    1999: A convincing full-time transvestite
    2001: An unconvincing full-time transvestite
    2003: An unconvincing part-time transvestite
    2005: A guy in a dress with a website
    2006: A dyke in jeans who acts like a guy in a dress with a website
    2007: A straight woman in jeans who acts like a gay guy in jeans
    2008: A straight woman in jeans who acts like a straight woman in jeans
    2009: A mother in jeans
    2010: Those obnoxious kids from the LGBT Center who call you "cis"
    2011: Those obnoxious kids from the LGBT Center who threaten your family
    2012: A retired soldier starting his second career as a teenage girl
    2013: (TBA)

    ReplyDelete